Topic: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

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Hi / Help:


I'm 49 years old and picked up acoustic guitar about 14 months ago despite having broken my left wrist 2X in my youth and having degenerative arthritis in my left thumb (I'm right handed).  The first 12 months I did w/out a teacher.  Have been taking lessons for 7 weeks from a musical genius (plays all from: piano, sax, trumpet, guitar) whose fav instument is CLASSICAL GUITAR.  I just had my 2nd cortisone shot in my left thumb in 9 months.  Doc says no more shots, next time it will be surgery. My guitar teacher insists that I try to play barre chords even though it hurts my left wrist and thumb to try and I cannot even come close to playing them.


Is it absolutely Vital that I play barre chords to be able to play good music.  I like Blue Grass & 60-80's rock, but am a longtime Deadhead.


Please tell me if I'm going to have to give up my life-long dream of playing guitar due to barre chords!


Steven

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

I've been playing since '68, and did a career in the military until being disabled in-the-line-of-duty.  I've got a pretty fair amount of arthritis and most mornings, everything hurts until I move around awhile and take enough aspirin to make my ears ring, LOL!  That doesn't stop me.


I can play barre chords, but rarely do.  I play a lot of stuff in first position, fingerpicking style and rarely hit a barre chord.  You can learn to transpose keys to fit your voice and give you easier chord shapes, or use a capo, and you can play an abbreviated version of any barre chords required.


I do tons of classic rock, country, and yes, even play some Dead.  I do Ripple, Brokedown Palace, Operator, and so on, from the "American Beauty" album without getting into any barre chords.  "Ripple" in particular plays very nice when Travis picked, you can sound like the whole band, and doesn't require the use of any barre chords.


Have a look at the books I listed in the thread linked below.  If you study those, you won't have any trouble playing endless songs without barre chords.


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.chordie.com/forum/index.php?t=tree&th=1285&mid=5885&S=3392bc579166c2d4e56218419631e6d1&rev=&reveal=" target="_blank">   http://www.chordie.com/forum/index.php? … 285&am p;am p;am   p;mid=5885&S=3392bc579166c2d4e56218419631e6d1&rev=&a mp;a mp;a mp;reveal=</a>


Bottom line: Don't lose hope.  You can do it, and the more you learn, the more you can work your way around any limitations you may have with the chord shapes.


Oubaas <img src="images/smiley_icons/icon_smile.gif" border=0 alt="Smile">

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

Oubass,


Thank you so much for your encouragement and book advice.  I just ordered the following:


"Guitar Chords and Scales: An Easy Reference for Acoustic or Electric Guitar" Hal Leonard Corp.; Paperback; $5.95


"The Art of Contemporary Travis Picking: How to Play the Alternating Bass Fingerpicking Style (Bk & CD)" Mark D. Hanson; Paperback; $14.16


"The Art of Solo Fingerpicking : How to Play Alternating-Bass Fingerstyle Guitar Solos (book and CD) (Guitar Books)" Mark Hanson; Paperback; $14.16



I have been playing with the chords of 'Box of Rain' for most of my limited self-taught time.  Do you fingerpick this song?  I'd love to know how.  As for singing, I don't really have too much interest in that.  I've been told my voice sounds like Robert Hunter's (song writer for the Dead).


I'd really hate to quit taking lessons so soon.  But last night I tried unsuccessfully for about 45 minutes to play some 'easy' barre chords my teacher gave me for this weeks lesson. Frustrated, I finally gave up, exhausting my left hand/thumb and my attitude!  Can I learn to play well without an instructor or do I just need to find a teacher who is willing to teach to the level of my physical ability?  I fear if I continue butting my head up against my real physical limitation wall, I will quit altogether.  This would be a personal tradegy.  14 months ago at age 48, I told myself that it was now or never and have practiced 20 - 75+ minutes almost every day since.  I've not taken a day off since before Christmas.


I really want to play, fingerstyle or otherwise.  I have a Guild GAD50E acoustic/electric.  For Christmas, my wife bought me a Gibson SG standard electric even though I have a long way to go to being able to play.???


Any ideas, advice and encouragement will be greatly appreciated.


Steven

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

Box of Rain fingerpicks very nicely.  You can use a plain old inside/outside picking pattern with your right hand.  For example, with a D chord, fretted like this as you look at the front of the fretboard:


654321

EADGBe

XX0232


You'd pluck the fourth string with the thumb of your right hand, then the first string with your middle finger, then the third string with your thumb, then the second string with your index finger.  Repeat.


With a G chord:


654321

EADGBe

320003


You'd pluck the sixth string with your thumb, the first string with your middle finger, the third string with your thumb, the second string with your index.


You can also alternate that first thumb pluck each time through between the sixth and fifth strings, and the treble string between the first fretted at third fret and an open second string.  Play around with it, adds variety.


The best transcription I've seen of Box of Rain is here:


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.guntheranderson.com/v/data/boxofrai.htm" target="_blank">http://www.guntheranderson.com/v/data/boxofrai.htm</a>


If you need to see right where the changes are, grab the one here at chordie, too, but it isn't as accurate as the one I linked.


Chords used are fretted thus:


D  XX0232

Am  X02210

Em  022000

C  X32010

G  320003

A  X02220

Bm XX4432 (versus the full barre)

Asus4  X02230


I usually do a little intro with A and Asus4 before hitting the D in the initial melody.  Always remeber that sheet music is merely a suggestion.  Play it any way you feel works for you.  You can change keys, or use a capo, too.


You've got a pair of excellent guitars there.  I love an SG, and the GAD50E is a sweetheart of a guitar.  I own the Guild GAD-40C and the GAD-30 amongst the six guitars I own.  That GAD series is a lot of bang for the buck!


Here's some other links you might find useful starting out:


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.frets.com" target="_blank">http://www.frets.com</a>


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.stew-mac.com" target="_blank">http://www.stew-mac.com</a>


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.lmii.com" target="_blank">http://www.lmii.com</a>


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.musiciansfriend.com" target="_blank">http://www.musiciansfriend.com</a>


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.americanmusical.com" target="_blank">http://www.americanmusical.com</a>


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.music123.com" target="_blank">http://www.music123.com</a>


As for singing, your voice is an intrument.  Everbody can sing.  If that wasn't true, Johnny Cash, Willie Nelson, and Kris Kristofferson, amongst others, would not have had singing careers.  But you have to practice.  I play and sing everyday.  I also read aloud to my wife while she crochets.  That helps exercise the voice.  We're doing Stephen King's "The Stand" right now.  Full, uncut, expanded version.  So yes, you can sing.  You just need to practice.  I can't play the trumpet right now, but if I pick it up and practice in a logical manner, eventually, I'll be able to.  Same as singing.


Have a look here:


<a href="http&#58;&#47;&#47;www.homespuntapes.com/catagory/default.asp?catID=25&ctype=i" target="_blank">  http://www.homespuntapes.com/catagory/d … D=25&a mp;a mp;ctype=i</a>


As for lessons, I don't see the point in forcing someone to try to play in a way that hurts.  Classical guitarists tend to be uptight about form.  But a good teacher can hurry you along the way.  But I've never taken lessons.  You'll have to decide the right path for you.  I Taught myself to play, sing, read music, and understand theory with books.  I must have done OK, too, because as I got down from the stage in Pretoria, South Africa one night, after singing a number, some kid ran up to me all excited and told me he had all my albums at home.  I thanked him, but I didn't bother to tell him that I don't have any albums.  My wife and I still crack up over that one now and then...


Oubaas  <img src="images/smiley_icons/icon_smile.gif" border=0 alt="Smile">

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

<img src="images/smiley_icons/icon_biggrin.gif" border=0 alt="Very Happy">

Oubaas,


Incredible info.  Likely, I'm not going to continue taking lessons.  It has really put a lot of stress on me trying to do the barre chords and my thumb will only get worse.  I can take enough ibuprofen as long as I'm not trying to do barre chords.


You have no idea how helpful you've been.  Inside/outside?  About the only thing I know about fingerpicking is the classical PIMI.


Well, I just got home from work, walked the dogs and now it is guitar time - one of the highlights of my day.  More later.  I can't wait to try the Box of Rain


What/when were you in South Africa?


Steven

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

LOL!  Well you have fun with that info and if you have any questions, post 'em and I'll try to answer 'em!


If you just keep repeating those picking instructions up there, it'll keep getting easier.  Start out with that D chord roll, inside/outside, thumb, middle, thumb, index like I explained above.  When that starts to smooth out, try switching back and forth between the D and G chord while picking.  You'll love Mark Hanson's book, he'll educate you very thoroughly on this sort of playing.  Those books you ordered are going to be a lot of fun for you.


Here's Mark's website:


<a href="http://www.accentonmusic.com/" target="_blank">http://www.accentonmusic.com/</a>


And if you want to do some flatpicking as well, here's Dan Crary's website:


<a href="http://www.dancrary.com/" target="_blank">http://www.dancrary.com/</a>


Dan's "Flatpicker's Guide" is my favorite flatpicking book.


<a href="http://www.amazon.com/Dan-Crary-Flatpickers-Guide/dp/1574240587/sr=1-1/qid=1172278238/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-3292697-3184861?ie=UTF8&s=books" target="_blank"> http://www.amazon.com/Dan-Crary-Flatpic … dp/1574240 587/sr=1-1/qid=1172278238/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-3292697-318486 1?ie=UTF8&s=books</a>


I was disabled in-the-line-of duty in the U.S. armed forces and medically retired in 1991.  I happened to meet a beautiful young South African woman about seven years later and we hit it off.  About a week after she got back to South Africa, she phoned me here in the states and said, "You've been everyplace else in the world, won't you come and try my country for awhile?"  So I sold the house I owned at the time and two weeks later stepped off a plane in Johannesburg and was just about knocked over by an auburn-haired missile.  She was pretty happy I came over.  I stayed there five years, married her, and we've now got two kids and have moved back to the U.S.  She became a U.S. citizen awhile back.  What a sweet young thing like her sees in an old geezer like me I have no idea, but I'm glad she sees it, whatever it is, LOL!


Oubaas  <img src="images/smiley_icons/icon_biggrin.gif" border=0 alt="Very Happy">

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

Generally you should learn to barre, but if it's going to cause you injury rather than just pain (it hurts everyone for a while <img src="images/smiley_icons/icon_smile.gif" border=0 alt="Smile">  ) then learn the open chord shapes, and get a cappo.


You can play bluegrass all day long with out the barre.   Bluegrass is rediculously simple for guitar players.  I just got back from the Wintergrass Bluegrass Festival in Tacoma, and there wasn't but one or two guitar players that played anything but open G C and D cappoed to whatever key their song was in.

Someday we'll win this thing...

[url=http://www.aclosesecond.com]www.aclosesecond.com[/url]

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

I prefer to use open chords. I capo a lot. It's not that I can't barre, I just prefer the open sound. Of course there are times you just have barre but on the whole you can get away with it quite a bit.

Is anything really made up of zeros and ones??

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

<table border="0" align="center" width="90%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td class="SmallText"><b>alvee33 wrote on Mon, 26 February 2007 20&#58;59</b></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
I prefer to use open chords. I capo a lot. It's not that I can't barre, I just prefer the open sound. Of course there are times you just have barre but on the whole you can get away with it quite a bit.
</td></tr></table>



If the "open sound" is different from the closed shapes usually because you aren't barreing cleanly.


The barre opens up the entire fretboard for your use, and gives you access to all voicings for a given chord.


It's not critical for some kinds of music (bluegrass) but it gives you a whole lot more options than just a capo and open chord shapes.

Someday we'll win this thing...

[url=http://www.aclosesecond.com]www.aclosesecond.com[/url]

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

I play a lot of jazz.  I access the entire fretboard all the time.  I rarely play barre chords.  And I can transcribe keys in my head, on the fly while playing.  Barre chords really aren't all that important.  Understanding music is far more important.  Barre chords are actually a rather simplistic way of solving a chord problem by barring another chord's shape.  Knowing theory, being able to construct chords, knowing which degree to drop if you abbreviate, understanding chord substitutions, etcetera, will all steer you around the fretboard and allow you to play things the way you want to play them rather than being stuck with fifteen chords and a barre to fall back on.  And the best way to learn those sorts of things is to play jazz.  Check out some of the instructional material that Joe Pass left us.


Oubaas  <img src="images/smiley_icons/icon_smile.gif" border=0 alt="Smile">

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

I think the beauty of music is that you can pretty much move things around and abbreviate to suit your needs. Maybe, if this teacher continues to insist you learn barre chords, perhaps it's time to find someone who's willing to teach you to play without learning something that's going to make it too difficult to enjoy. i mean this is enjoyment for me and I'm doing it for enjoyment. Not to compete in something that depends on absolute correctness. I do understand the excercises may help to strengthen, however in your case, maybe you should consider alternatives. Just work for something that's right for you. There's always someone who will join in and join you somewhere who won't care that you don't play barre chords. Just enjoy!

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

Well, I really don't understand (yet) about abreviating and changing chords on the fly, but I'm sure I can pick it up in time.


Another physical flaw I failed to mention is on my fret hand, my ring finger is quite curved toward the middle finger, from the joint nearest the fingertip compliments of a flag football game back in the 1900's.  When I close this hand, there is a good 3/8" gap between the ring finger and pinky. This adds to the frustration of trying to barre.  On the Dm7 (among others) my ring finger is closer to the 6th fret than the 7th (thud).  Also, I cannot hold an A chord with fingers 2-4.  But, I can bar it with my index finger and also with fingers 1-3.


So why I have not always yearned to play trumpet rather than guitar?  Sure would make reaching the goal more certain.  But to me there is nothing as sweet as the sound of an acoustic guitar.


I would love to be able to play at least a couple of songs now while working thru the books I ordered.  Are the songs below too much for a beginner?  If not how do I figure how to play them fingerstyle?  Seeing the chords alone doesn't tell me too much.  Will PIMI, inside/outside work?


Big Rock Candy Mountain

Paradise (John Prine)

Wildwood Flower

Somewhere Over the Rainbow

Tennessee Stud


Steven

Re: Arthritis-Are Barre Chords the only way to play acoustic?

An outside/inside pattern (I see I was calling it "inside/outside" above.  Wrong and confusing.  Must have been sniffing airplane glue that day, LOL!) will work with about anything in 4/4 common time.  The only one of those songs I play is occasionally "Over The Rainbow", and yes, it works with that.


Instead of playing Dm7 up in second position, try fretting it like this:


654321

EADGBe

XX0211


Over The Rainbow


C                  Em

Somewhere, over the rainbow,


F           C

Way up high;


F             C              Am

There&#8217;s a land that I heard of,


Dm7        G    C

Once in a lullaby.


                   Em

Somewhere, over the rainbow


F             C

Skies are blue.


F            C                      Am

And the dreams that you dare to


Dm7              G          C

Dream really do come true.



Someday I&#8217;ll wish upon a star


        F                                                     C

And wake up where the clouds are far behind me.



Where troubles melt like lemon drops


   F#dim

Away above the chimney tops,


           Dm7            G     

That&#8217;s where you&#8217;ll find me.


C                  Em

Somewhere, over the rainbow


F             C

Bluebirds fly.


F            C           Am

Birds fly over the rainbow,


Dm7              G             C

Why then, oh why can&#8217;t I?



If happy little bluebirds fly


Dm7

Beyond the rainbow,


F            G             C

Why, oh why can&#8217;t I?


You'll have to listen for the changes, I see the chords aren't holding their tab places in the post preview.  But it's easy to hear when to change.


You play an F#dim like this:


654321

EADGBe

XX1212


...and you'd pick it outside/inside, oicking it like everything else played that way, i.e., thumb plucks root note on fourth string, middle plucks treble note on first string, thumb plucks third string, index plucks second string.  Repeat, and so on.


I think you're going to find Mark Hanson's books to be just what you've been looking for.


Oubaas  <img src="images/smiley_icons/icon_smile.gif" border=0 alt="Smile">